Lighting suggestions

[Patrick Jenkins]

I need to retrofit my house with a better lighting system. My problem is two fold. First I can't seem to find anything I like at all in the hardware stores. Haven't really found anything on the net, yet.
My other problem is I will need to stay where the electric sources are. This is for my kitchen right now. Does anyone know of any cool sites out there? Are there site to tell you how to design a good system?
The rest of the house I am making my own fixtures to suit my theme. :confused:

[Susan]

Patrick,
I'm not sure what your decorating style is but here are two ideas for you:

I happen to like salvaged items(same thing as "antique" but cheaper since some frou-frou interior designer hasn't bought it and marked it up 300%) so you could start looking at flea markets, buildings to be demo-ed etc.
Here's a site that has some nice old fixtures(but they're pricey because of the "frou-frou" designer):rolleyes:
http://www.legacyofmpls.com/lighting.htm

Also, here's a link to a site with a lot of info and links to other lighting sites. Couple of good sources, depending on what you're looking for

http://www.decoratingstudio.com/directory_of_links/lighting/builtinlighting.htm


Also, GE used to have something on the web about lighting, but I can't seem to find it now.

Good hunting!
:)

[Dan Bodenstein]

Patrick,
Try this web site. We found many different items at their web site for our house.

http://www.cowboyindian.com/light.htm

The website is "cheezy", but there is a variety of different styles.

Have you thought about full spectrum lighting?

Dan

[Stephanie]

If you like indirect lighting, my cousin used those strings of light in a flexible tube (I don't know what that's called) that you can get at Lowe's or whatever. He placed it on the tops of his beams and at the top of his kitchen cabinets. It looked really good!! Rather like having candles lit but without the candles!

[lisa]

I am just now experimenting with some lighting for my new house. I've bookmarked over 50 sites with fixtures I liked for a cabin, however the prices are outragous.

I am focused on some up lighting for the beams and ceiling this week. I went to Home Depot and purchased a narrow shop light with a deflector that overhangs the light ballast. I went to the paint dept and got some "rust" faux finish and plan to use this to cover the fixture and then see how it would look placed on top of the beams to provide up lighting. If this works it will be a very inexpensive solution as the whole thing cost under $25.

Another thing I've seen done and plan to incorporate is taking an old Colander and creating a hanging light fixture in the kitchen by inverting it, adding a lamp kit and then a circle light in the middle. I bought several old colanders on e-bay recently for under $5 and have the light ready to install in it.

http://www.garbes.com/lighting/hilite3.html this site features some lighting by a company called hi - lite. I have a book of their fixtures from my local electrical company. Many of them are very very unique and designed for rustic applications. A lot of them are commercial fixtures you will have seen in chain resturants like On the Border, Chili's, Tia etc.....

If you want some of the bookmarks I have for lighting - e-mail me directly - it's way to many to list here. stegall@up-link.net

Lisa

[Kyle - Utah]

Hello Patrick,

Now don't laugh until you've heard me out, ok? ;)

You might consider using LED banks instead of traditional bulbs. In doing so, you will reduce not only your electrical bills, but also your eye strain.

There are many new high-output LEDs out there these days. Nichia makes what I personally feel to be the best of the pure white, but there are many others as well. By 'high-output' I am talking about 9,200 mcd (Milli-Candella) from direct DC 30 mA voltage to 12,000 mcd pulsed DC at 3.3 - 4.0V. That's a LOT of light from one tiny LED. A good example of all of this is to note that most new traffic signals use banks of 124 4,800 mcd LEDs per 'bulb'.

(If you're wondering what a milli-candella is then the following link is about as useful as any that I can find:
www.natmus.dk/cons/tp/lightcd/light_cd.htm (http://www.natmus.dk/cons/tp/lightcd/light_cd.htm) Suffice it to say that there is no clear comparison to wattage output from this unit. You must first convert to Lumen Steradians and then to Lux and then you'll be even more confused than you were at the beginning of all of this.)

From there things get more interesting. High mcd ratings are much more common and inexpensive in colored LEDs. So, you place a couple of green, red, and yellow LEDs into the bank with their own control pad (More on this later) until you get the exact glow that you want for the space. No more eye strain from lights that are too stark or seemingly too blue.

The exact number of White LEDs to use per station will depend on the height of the ceiling, the type of lighting effect that you want, and any number of other factors. Do you want a glowing diffused lght? Do you want a 'spotlight effect'? Do you want cascading light? Etc... To find the answers to this, you will need to play with the 'fixture' itself. To do this, you will need some LEDs to play with. I would suggest any of the larger Internet auction houses for both the LEDs themselves and an inexpensive power supply to test things with. a nice 3.6V transformer is usually available for under $10 (US) and the LEDs themselves might range from $0.75 to $3.00 (US) each for the white and a fraction of a cent each for colored.

Once you have these components, you will need something to plug them into for testing. Just about any electronics supply house will carry a small white plastic item typically called a 'Breadboard' These work extremely well for this application. You simply push the ends of the LEDs into the board with one lead on each pole (The breadboard will explain this when you see it) and apply the power to see the effect. This makes for a very inexpensive control/design pad. Just make sure to follow the warnings on the LEDs themselves. Staring directly into the lights at close range can be dangerous to your eyes in the same way that staring into a 1,000 Watt floodlamp can be dangerous. (I'm not trying to scare anyone here; I just don't want to assume any liability because I forgot to state the obvious.)

Once you have your control pad all hooked up, you'll be able to play around to create the exact shade of light that you want. It's kind of like being able to add a bit of red and a touch of yellow to your lightbulbs when you pick them up from the store. Even more fun is knowing that you will likely never have to change a single LED in your lifetime if you follow the manufacturer's recommended voltage requirements.

Wattage = Voltage times Amperage (Current) This means that Amperage = Wattage divided by Voltage. This means that a 100 Watt bulb at 110 Volts draws roughly .909 Amperes (Amps). A bank of ten 9,200 mcd LEDs draws roughly 1.2 Watts and a maximum of 1 Amp at 3.6 Volts. You will lose some power by using a transformer and DC line loss but the overall energy and cost savings will be staggering.

Can you use existing 'Romex' wiring for all of this? I would not recommend it! Instead, most home centers sell wiring for low voltage systems used primarily for garden lighting. It has much better insulation for DC current and will meet most building codes much better than traditional solid Copper wire. (Don't use low voltage wire for 110 VAC applications. Not only will it fail most building codes, but it could very well lead to a fire, electrocution, or other nasty things.) No matter what wiring you think will work best, please consult a licensed electrician in your area before putting it into use.

And now for the fun stuff...

In the event that you decide that you want to use staggered diffused LEDs along the chinking and at several heights, place the diffusing filters on the LEDs and then 'paint' them with a silicone sealant. I use RTV but just about any non-conductive brand will work. Then, after you've chinked them into place so that the filter is protruding from the chinking, simply rub off the silicone to reveal the filtered lights. The thin layer that remains under the chinking may be pressed back with a toothpick to give you some adjustment room for fine tuning. Just be sure to apply a tiny bit more once you have the LED positioned exactly as you want it. This will prevent any moisture or debris from getting to the contacts.

I should also note that there are DC to DC transformers out there. This means that it would be as simple as flipping a switch to go from a 110V line to a 12V Deep-Cycle Marine battery system if the power were to go out without warning. An electrician could easily install a system that would switch you to the battery when the power went out and back to the main line when it came back on automatically for you. I have such a configuration but I am not willing to detail the process because it involves procedures that require a licensed electrician to comply with building codes in most areas.

As for making the actual fixtures themselves, you have several options. You may choose to solder the individual leads to traditional screw-in bases. You may choose to use modular lighting plugs that are already in the 2-prong format. Or, probably the best choice for most people, you may take the LEDs to an electronics service center to have them create the actual 'bulbs' for whatever type of socket that you prefer to use. (If you do this, please mark out on a piece of graph paper exactly where the colored LEDs are to be placed in conjunction with the white LEDs - It would be a shame for you to have taken all of the time required to create the ideal light only to find that the technician lumped all of the colored LEDs together.)

For less than $50.00(US) you can tinker and play with the idea to see if it is something that interests you.

One final group of disclaimers: Please understand that standard AC outlets are not suitable for use with LEDs without extreme modifications. Any use of LEDs in standard outlets can be extremely dangerous! Marking LED 'bulbs' with a 'DC Use Only' sticker is a very good idea and may be required in your area. Please consult a licensed electrician before attempting any permanent installation of any of the items discussed in this article!

Best Regards

[Patrick Jenkins]

Kyle,
Without sounding like I took a smaller bus to school and left later in the day and wore a hockey helmet without being on a team. I have to admit I have no clue what you said. I know you must been one of the smarter kids.
Have you installed those"lights"?
It sounds pretty complex.:confused:
Is there a country boy tranlation? Please don't tell me that was or I will have to wear my hockey helmet again!:rolleyes:

[BradBradstreet]

When we were checking out different styles and suppliers of log homes we visited a nice large log home in western NJ. Wonderful place. The owner was the owner of a good sized electrical company. He said he went to school to learn how to light a log home!

It is different. Designs quite often have high ceilings - exposed purlins and trusses. His thoughts were very interesting. The fact that he had to learn more before he could be comfortable dealing with lighting the inside of a log home says something. I listened.

[Patrick Jenkins]

Brad,
My problem is the lights I have now are 2 track lights mounted on the outside walls. There is no wiring going down the center of the kitchen on the log. I don't want to run a conduit exposed down the log. I will if I have no choice. The top log is the bottom half of a log.

[BradBradstreet]

Yup. Where are those fellows who were inventing wireless lights when you need them?

[Kyle - Utah]

Hello again Partick,

I'm sorry about all of the tecchie talk in the original post. Please allow me to summarize...

By using what are called Super Bright LEDs you will be able to create custom lighting options to suit your tastes. This includes the exact amount of red, blue, and yellow that each 'bulb' gives off. Some people add a soft pink or blue bulb to a room to create a 'warm' or 'cool' feeling. It's the same principle but you can do it with individual lights.

The amount of electricity that these lights consume is next to nothing. (A single 12 Volt Marine battery could run all of the lights in your log home for many hours, but standard 110VAC (or 220VAC European and some Canadian) can be converted to DC so that a battery is not necessary. A good example of electrical usage might be to compare a standard 4 Watt night light bulb to a rough equivalent of 400 Watts using LEDs instead of incandescent bulbs.

LEDs remain viable for many hours of operation. The Nichia brand warranties their products for 120,000 hours of continuous use. That's roughly 13.7 years of continuous operation. That's a long time to go without the need to change a lightbulb.

I did not mention in my previous post that there are premanufactured LED 'bulbs' on the market today that use standard electrical outlets. These do exist but are, IMHO, very inefficient and have a built in 'lifespan' of up to 5 years under normal usage conditions. The main reason for this is that they use AC current rather than DC. The short explanation is that AC has an 'On' and and 'Off' cycle that repeats 60 times a second in standard 110 V power. Most premanufactured LED 'bulbs' have a little chip inside that converts the 'off' cyle to an 'on' cycle. (There's a lot more to it than that but I will spare you the details.) What happens is that the chips usually 'die' after a few years of doing their jobs. These chips also consume a great deal more electricity than what is used by standard DC operation.

By going to one of the Internet auction houses, or a local electronics store, you will be able to pick up all of the parts necessary to play with this idea yourself. Once you see how easy it is, you will probably jump in with both feet. If you have children in the house then the Dollar savings signs will go off in your head and you will probably become overenthusiastic. This is where it might be a good idea to pass the project along to people who do this sort of thing for a living. On the other hand, if you are a true DIY type of person then you might fire up the soldering iron and start building custom low power consumption 'bulbs' on your own.

As for whether I have done an install like this myself, the answer is a resounding yes. I have done four so far; each with better results than the previous installation. Of these, my favorite to date is an installation where the LEDs are actually positioned in the upper chinking of the walls themselves. By using diffusing filters (much like miniature versions of the rectangular filters used to make recessed flourescent tube lighting easier on the eyes) I was able to make the walls of the rooms the actual lighting source. This creates a warm and bright 'glow' that causes no eye strain no matter where you are within the rooms. I should note that this is not sufficient in very large rooms, but is wonderful in standard bedrooms, bathrooms, and smaller (say up to 15 x 15) living areas.

Areas like livingrooms and kitchens require more light. This is where multiple LED 'bulbs' are required. They are also useful when you want to highlight a painting on the wall, a piece of furniture, a writing desk, and so on.

I also suggest keeping the standard 110 VAC electrical system completely separate from the lighting electrical system. It is possible to use existing wiring and to 'cut in' DC power using a transformer, but I strongly discourage this option. Keeping the two separate will ensure a safe and efficient way to provide inexpensive and more personalized lighting. Going to all DC is not practical unless you do not use televisions, blenders, microwave ovens and the like.

Finally, it is quite practical to include a deep cycle 12 Volt marine battery that will automatically 'turn on' if the main power to the home is cut. This is best accomplished by a licensed electrician.

I hope that this helps to clear up the confusion that all of the overly technical writing in my original post caused.

Best Regards

[mfritch]

Patrick, you live in Alaska so Anchorage may be the only place to find a store like one we have here in Portland, Oregon. The place is called Hippo Hardware and they sell every form of recycled plumbing and light fixture you can think of. There is also a company that does custom demolition work on structures. They will actually pay you a bit of money to come in and tear down and recycle the materials. Many times their stuff presold. You can call them and ask if they know if any particular item that may be coming up on their horizon. These outfits can often be found in the Yellow Pages under Building Materials, Recycled or Salvaged. They are a great starting point for ideas and odd materials for the owner built fixture as well.

[Patrick Jenkins]

MArk,
I live in Orting Washington. I left Alaska a while ago.

[Gravitas Boise]

http://www.rejuvenation.com/